Is AirBNB What Its Cracked Up To Be? Check the Data with John Bianchi

John Bianchi: [0:00] They just start running to all these cities and buying all these different properties for Airbnb. They're gonna be really hurt when all this sort of dies down over the summer or so, and it gets oversaturated. So, anyways

Speaker 2: [0:11] Welcome to the Collecting Keys real estate investing podcast with your host, Mike DeHaan and Dan Austin. From wins, losses, horror stories, and tactics for optimizing your business, Mike and Dan take a real uncensored deep dive into the ins and outs of running a full time real estate investment and wholesaling business.

Mike DeHaan: [0:34] What's going on, guys? On this episode of the collecting keys podcast, I have John Bianchi, the self proclaimed Airbnb data guy. And I was really excited to have John on because I am a little bit of an Airbnb skeptic and he approaches Airbnb and Airbnb analytics from a truly data standpoint, looking at historical, looking at what's actually going on on the platforms, as opposed to just like the fluffy, you will crush all real estate investing with Airbnb. They could shove down everyone's throats on social media. So I'm really excited to have him on, and we have a really great discussion today getting into the weeds on that. He has a great YouTube series. Definitely go check him out on there where he goes into how exactly he does his analytics. If you just look up the Airbnb data guy on YouTube, you will find him. Please let me know what you think about this episode by shooting me an email at mike@collectingkeyspodcast.com or sending me a DM on Instagram at mike underscore invest. I love any feedback as we're starting to get more and more guests on the show. Besides that guys, make sure that you subscribe and you share this podcast with anyone who might find it insightful, especially if they have an interest in dabbling in Airbnb at all. And, thanks so much, guys. Enjoy the show with John Bianchi.

Mike DeHaan: [1:50] What's going on, guys? I am here alone. No Dan today. He's off on baby duty. But I am here with John Bianchi, who is the, I guess, self proclaimed Airbnb data guy, or did did someone someone give you that name and you decided to roll

John Bianchi: [2:04] with it?

Mike DeHaan: [2:04] Where where does that come from?

John Bianchi: [2:05] It's sort of a mix of the two. I've sort of people call me like, oh, you're the data guy and all that stuff. And so I just sort of went with it, And it works. Yeah. It's a little branding technique, know? Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [2:14] Yeah. For sure. I mean, you gotta have a shit. Right? You know, everyone has to have have something. Know, that's why I know Brandon Turner and Bigger Pockets, he rolls with the beard. And he specifically says that so he's memorable for his brand. Right? Because even his Instagram is beardy Brandon.

John Bianchi: [2:27] Alex Ramosy does the same thing with his mustache. He's got a nice big handlebar mustache, and he went to sell business, and he actually had to keep the mustache on when he sold it. That was a part of the deal.

Mike DeHaan: [2:37] Yeah. I've seen that. I mean, you can do everything. Right? That's why it's all jacked now too. And that's like his whole thing as well as like the jacked mustache ecommerce guy. Yeah. He does. Cool, man. So did you come from a, like, data background as like an engineer? Or did you just basically get into Airbnb and that was sort of what you stuck with?

John Bianchi: [2:55] No. I have no I have no data background. I really didn't go to college or or university or anything like that. My way of getting into this was just pure curiosity. So, like, I was an investor before this. As a financial planner, I managed a $10,000,000 portfolio of people's retirement fund in mutual funds. Right? Which is really just a bunch of people who have their life savings with me and ensuring that they don't lose it all. Right? It's not like playing in the stocks or anything like that. So I wasn't like a really in-depth investor, but I could read the numbers fairly easily and that always intrigued me. And then I came across this website called AirDNA, and AirDNA has all of the data that exists in every single Airbnb in the world and how much money they're all making. And that kind of blew my mind. Right? So I was like, that's incredible. And then I just started to dive into that more and more and more. And just like the interest in it is really what drove me to be able to understand how to use it and work with it. Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [3:53] Okay. Okay, cool. So I guess started on that financial planning path, I guess, give us like the full rundown, you know, so you didn't go to college, you went through the financial planning, you like one of the Northwestern Mutual guys that's out there sending cold messages on LinkedIn, trying to find people. Like, what was that? And then you obviously got into air Airbnb after that.

John Bianchi: [4:12] Yeah. Exactly. So, you know, I always knew I wanted to own my own business, but I never had, like, capital to be able to do it. So, I couldn't just go out there and buy a subway. Right? But so the whole idea of, like, becoming a financial planner, I got sold the dream of you can start this business without any money and you build up your clientele, then all of sudden, you're good to go. Right?

Mike DeHaan: [4:27] It's like a pyramid scheme, but for, you know, like, white guys who are driven as opposed to stay at home moms, you know?

John Bianchi: [4:33] A that's a good way to put it, honestly. And I got sold the dream. And, you know, I got to the point where like, I actually got really lucky. So I partnered with somebody and was able to take over a portion of his portfolio, which is why I was managing $10,000,000 at the age of 24. But I got, like, the insight into what it would would have been like. And I realized I absolutely hated the possibilities of that career. I just I felt very, very limiting. And I didn't wanna just sit in an office. I didn't just wanna have the same conversations. And I was like, I wanna do more than this. Right? And so I actively started, like, looking for other things that I could be doing and came across, like, Airbnb world by renting out my own extra room that I had. So I rented that out, realized I was making more money. Then I started reading a bunch of articles on just Google searching. Right? Then I came across AirDNA, then I realized I was like, it was actually possible, viable. And I started learning about other people who are building businesses around this. I started learning about the rental arbitrage model. And then I, you know, picked up one home, I picked up another home. And then I I raised $250,000 from investors to open up more homes.

John Bianchi: [5:34] And as soon as I had raised that money and we had, like, shook hands, signed the contracts, did all that fun stuff, that's when I sold off my investment business and went, like, all into the Airbnb world. Right? And so the only reason I was able to raise that $250,000 was because I understood the data really well. Right? Or at least I had, like, thought I understood it at that point really well. I still, like, learned a crazy amount since then. But at that point, it was enough for me to raise that money. And then I used that money and went out opened up about 15 locations in Chicago, some rental arbitrage, some management. And then 2020 came, business went to shit, and so I sold the business. Got really lucky because I actually had somebody who wanted to buy it, like, in April 2020, right, when everything was kinda falling apart. And then from there, I realized that I understood the Airbnb data really, really well. And so I created this little course, and I was gonna sell the course, I had no idea to sell the course. So I put on YouTube for free. And that putting it out there for free had created so much traction that I actually was able to create an Airbnb data consulting business out of that. And so now now I have that business consulting for people.

John Bianchi: [6:39] And I also am a full time Airbnb data analyst for Superhost Labs, which is a short term rental investment fund. So I'm, like, fully consumed.

Mike DeHaan: [6:47] Nice. So it sounds like what you were doing going up through that period was almost entirely arbitrage. Right? Or, like, were you actually buying properties?

John Bianchi: [6:55] Yeah. So I wasn't actually buying

Mike DeHaan: [6:56] Or, like, some management.

John Bianchi: [6:57] Yeah. So I wasn't buying any properties. I was just doing arbitrage, and I was also doing management. But I I was nowadays, with the fund, we bought, you know, about 40 properties, and I'm in charge of partially underwriting those properties to ensure that they're actually good to pick up. So I don't have any real life experience buying a property. I don't even have my own property. I still rent personally.

Mike DeHaan: [7:16] Oh, okay.

John Bianchi: [7:17] But, like, I am actively trying to learn as much as I possibly can at this exact moment so that I can go and buy as many Airbnb's as I possibly can for the rest of my life. Like that is the that's the goal. So it's a weird mix of like, a lot of experience and no experience.

Mike DeHaan: [7:31] For sure. Well, it's a different business model. And and I mean, I'll be honest, I am a Airbnb arbitrage skeptic just because I see it so heavily pressed

John Bianchi: [7:38] As you should be.

Mike DeHaan: [7:39] On Instagram and like by these different people, you know, and a lot of people floated as like, oh, you can get all this cash flow without actually having to buy a property, which, I mean, if you look at the numbers, makes sense, right? But at the same time, you don't own an asset, and you're still at a lot of liability, which people don't think realize because you go and you get into a premium lease with a landlord, and then all of a sudden, they ban short term rentals in that market or something crazy. You're still tied to that lease. You know? And I don't think that's made clear to a lot of people, but it sounds like you had it figured out in Chicago to point the that you were actually able to exit from that business. So, like, I guess that that's fascinating to me. What what did that look like?

John Bianchi: [8:15] It was just a matter of selling off all the contracts and selling off the business itself as a whole. Mhmm. And then the person who bought the business took over the leases. Some leases, we had to get the landlords approved, it'll transfer them once they were transferred, then you know, they took it over. And they paid me one year's cash flow from those properties, which was roughly about $20 piece.

Mike DeHaan: [8:32] Gotcha. So like one Yeah, one x EBIT, right? So so they paid you that for all the cash flow. So did you own the furniture? Was there like hard assets on this? Like, what what is it?

John Bianchi: [8:42] Yeah. So they also picked up the furniture, but like, at a discount in comparison. Plus, I've also sold literally in 2020 when everything went to shit. So I saw it as, like, a great way to kinda get away. I hindsight's 2020. I wish I would have kept it, and we'd be just fine. I'd still be, like, I'd still be managing all those properties, and they'd be doing great. But it wasn't the best, and you're 100% right to be a skeptic about Airbnb arbitrage. Right? So for anyone who doesn't fully know what that is, you're renting on a place, and then you're turning it into an Airbnb, and you're hoping to make more money than the rent that you're paying in the other utilities. Right? But the issue is that you take on so much liability, you have no assets, and you have to put up a whole bunch of money for all the furniture, and furniture is like, without a doubt, the worst asset you can own. It depreciates like crazy the second a walk gets inside the home. Right? Let alone after like two, three years with somebody actually using it. So I, like, I did I did about six or seven arbitrage deals before I I started doing management, then I just did management from there on out. Right? And management is just like for anyone who also doesn't know what that is, it's just a matter of, like, running the Airbnb for somebody else and taking a percentage. They put up all the furniture, they trust you to do all the work, and you take your 20% cut. Right?

John Bianchi: [9:53] So I warn people all the time about arbitrage, and I always try to promote management over that. But the issue is is that to get the experience, usually somebody won't allow you to manage their home for a percentage unless you know what the hell you're doing. And so I always say when you're getting started, start with an arbitrage and make it the smallest one you can possibly find, like a one bedroom or a studio, but ensure you're actually gonna make money

Mike DeHaan: [10:14] from it. Yeah. And a big thing with the arbitrage too, I'll just close out for people is, you know, make sure that the landlord signs off on this. You hear about people. I've seen people focus where they're like, Oh, I rented this property and I didn't tell the landlord I'm gonna sublease the two rooms. I mean, we specific specifically have in our long term leases that there's no subleasing at all, purely because we don't want people to be trying that where we're not in control of actually who's in our property. And that's a great way to get yourself into some major legal trouble.

John Bianchi: [10:41] Yep. First Airbnb I ever got evicted within the first month, had to turn into a corporate rental. I I swear to god. So, like, me and the guy that I was going to do it with, we, like, we're ready to go everything, and we found out, like, last minute, we weren't gonna be able to do it. And we didn't want it. We're like, god. Do we talk to him? Or what do we do? And then I don't know. We're just we're we're stupid. Right? Like, we didn't know what we're doing. We didn't know all the risks. We didn't know all these things. There wasn't a ton of information out there. And and we're just like, let's just do it. Let's just try and do it. One month, eviction letter slid underneath the door. Like, would never make that mistake again, try and warn everybody to not do that. And, like, it was it was just so stupid. You know, you realize that you just talk to people about talk to the landlord about it, and some are gonna say no, but some are people are gonna be open to it. Those are the people you're gonna work with. Right? And then you have a good working relationship moving forward. So I was one of those idiots that made that mistake, and I I learned from it the hard way.

Mike DeHaan: [11:29] That's funny. I can always respect the hustle, but you gotta follow rules

John Bianchi: [11:31] at least a little bit. Gotta follow the rules. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

Mike DeHaan: [11:34] So that's cool. And then you got lucky with that Chicago situation too. Because I mean, heard about people that were especially in, like, destinations. Like, there was one guy in particular. I forget which podcast it was. But he had, like, 40 something units in Honolulu.

John Bianchi: [11:46] Oh,

Mike DeHaan: [11:47] jeez. Like, all these, like, condos. And then COVID happened in Hawaii went into, like, hard lock.

John Bianchi: [11:51] Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [11:52] And he had to file bankruptcy because his monthly liability on his all those properties was, like, hundreds of thousands of dollars a month he could not afford.

John Bianchi: [12:00] I was at 35,000 a month. Really? Overnight, all the money gone. Like, like, literally to zero. And so I worked my ass off for that first month to get every single one of those units rented out. And luckily, I'm in Chicago and I had these big four bedrooms. So, like, I was able to get them all rented out in, like, under a month. I think I lost, Like, lost money without a doubt, but it could have been a lot worse.

Mike DeHaan: [12:24] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I can get super slippery. And even when people are buying some of these, this is this is a big reason I'm like, I'm a little bit of Airbnb skeptic in general right now too. Specifically because I live in Eastern Washington. You know, North Idaho was a very, very hot Airbnb market, like especially with like all the lakes and stuff. People have been buying properties out here for like 20% over retail value because they'll be like, oh, during the summer, you know, I can rent it for like $4,000 for a weekend because it's this huge lake place. But like what happened is one of the main areas up here, people do that. They suddenly came out and said like, Airbnb's are fine. They support our economy, but only if you have a license. And we're only giving out x number of And all of a sudden, it was a scramble to get those licenses. And the people that couldn't get them, they're now shit out of luck, right? Like they can't Airbnb their places anymore. Now they have these properties they can't afford themselves. They can't rent them. It's not going to work as a long term rental. And they're trying to liquidate these lake cabins, Right? And that's when they can happen anywhere.

John Bianchi: [13:21] You gotta this was a three step process to Airbnb. First one, regulation.

Mike DeHaan: [13:25] Yeah.

John Bianchi: [13:25] Figure out the regulation and go to a place that has regulation so it doesn't change on you. Right? Because usually once it's in place, it's not gonna change.

Mike DeHaan: [13:32] That's a good rule. Yeah.

John Bianchi: [13:33] Two is data. Once you understand the data, like, try to find a ton of comparable properties that are actually performing really well and truly understand how much that home is actually gonna make before you go out and buy it and ensure that it is actually gonna cash flow. Right? If you can understand that, if you can prove that, then then sure. And then three is operations. Operations is once you have the place, it's easy to figure out. There's a million videos on it. It's just simple operations. But, like, you gotta go one, two, three. Yeah. If you do it in any other order, you're you're fucked. Because, like

Mike DeHaan: [14:00] Yeah.

John Bianchi: [14:00] Anyways yeah. Yeah. Regulations is number one. Like, without a doubt.

Mike DeHaan: [14:04] Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. For sure.

John Bianchi: [14:05] What else are you skeptical about with Airbnb? I'd love to hear what you're thinking.

Mike DeHaan: [14:10] Oh, man. Like, don't even get me started. Lot of

John Bianchi: [14:13] like, Airbnb data. Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [14:17] Yeah. Right. So I mean, the we already touched on the arbitrage, I think that that's heavily pushed on people who are not in a position to understand that it's a business, and they don't understand the risks and liabilities associated with that.

John Bianchi: [14:28] And you're

Mike DeHaan: [14:28] Which I mean, to be fair, comes across with a lot of real estate investing. And then when it comes to people buying Airbnb's, especially in these hot markets, like I'm really involved in these different masterminds for different things. I'm in this group called GoBundance, which is like, it's like a millionaire mastermind, right, for people that have, like, a high net worth, I guess, highest net worth, and they have a successful business. Right? So and they want they wanna, like, you know, live these lifestyle sort of businesses, and that's, like, the whole premise. You go to these conferences, and there are so many dudes there that crush it. And you can throw a rock in any direction and hit one that's like, oh, yeah. My thing is I buy short term rentals in The Smokies. Like, and that's all they do to the point that they trade them like playing cards, you know, and they're paying absurd amounts for these properties. And then all of a sudden, this past year, they're like, uh-oh, people aren't coming to The Smokies as much as they did last year. Like, my my Airbnb is underwater. Yeah. And I so, you know, that can that people sort of hype each other up with that. And then the third thing that I always hit on for Airbnb is people that get into kind of growing, like, cities. So actually Spokane where I live is a big example of this.

Mike DeHaan: [15:32] And they start buying up all these Airbnb's, and their game plan is like, I'm gonna create temporary housing for people that are moving here for jobs, are here for temporary work, are like, you know, traveling professionals, whatever. And they start buying up all these homes in these neighborhoods. And then what it does is it prices out the living population in these areas. Yeah. Right? Because all of a sudden, you have these homes that could be family homes, could be long term rentals, could be anything. And they're now like, Well, I'm only going to rent this thing out for 3x normal rental rate a month because, you know, it's going to go to someone that's going to be here for two months out of the year, like two month, two month period

John Bianchi: [16:06] of time.

Mike DeHaan: [16:06] Right? Yeah. And you see an influx of that, which A, affects the housing market, you know, in general, B, puts a major damper on the lower middle income people in the in the area. And then lastly, it's also high risk because they're overpaying for these properties. And then all of a sudden, a regulation comes into play or the thing is saturated. And they're now underwater on this house, which is gonna make the market crash in the long term if there's too many of those.

John Bianchi: [16:29] You're right on all of those things. Like with without a doubt, right on all of them, right? Like, so the reality about Airbnb is that it's it's not the best choice at all times. Like the vast majority of places are better off as short term rentals. I always say that, right? Or sorry, as long term rentals. And there's way too many people that are doing it in certain areas, and they're they're cannibalizing each other. Right? Like, Houston, Texas is an area where so many new Airbnb's have gone in there within the past, like, year to two years that they have. It's getting close to oversaturation. It's actually not there yet. Surprisingly, it's not there, but they've gone up by, like, thousands in that area. And it's mainly because there's no regulation against it, but regulation's coming. Right? You're right about the housing area. I used to get really upset with, like, the regulations that they would put into certain cities. I'm like, oh, why are they trying to stop Airbnbs? But, like, the reality is that people need housing more than they need Airbnbs, and these are really jacking up the prices for people. And so that whole logic makes a lot of sense. Like, these major cities like San Francisco, New York, Toronto, Vancouver, British Columbia, I'm Canadian.

John Bianchi: [17:33] Yeah. They they have banned Airbnbs, like, almost across the board. Right? So those areas, completely agree with because then everybody living there is doing okay. You know I mean? Like, they can actually afford, for the most part, the housing that is actually there. So I do I do support all that. But there's there's a sweet spot with Airbnb. Right? You kinda you wanna be in the area. You don't wanna oversaturate yourself once. One, you don't wanna also over project. Right? And you kinda wanna find an area that's gonna be there for a really long time. And so the these guys in the Smokies, like Smokies, Poconos, Joshua Tree, Blue Ridge, all of these areas, everyone was overpaying and buying as much as they possibly could in that area, because Airbnb was absolutely thriving in those areas for the past two years because of COVID. So it made kinda made a ton of sense. And also a lot of YouTubers were pushing it and they were like saying, all these areas are great. These areas are great. Right? And so everyone's doing it. But within the past two months, Airbnb has actually completely changed the way that you go and search for a property specifically in those areas. Right? So if you wanna go to, like, The Smokies, they no longer normally, you type in Gatlinburg and you look at Gatlinburg and you would see all the best all the properties in Gatlinburg. Right? But what they've done is they've now done it where it's like, okay.

John Bianchi: [18:47] You you you wanna look at Gatlinburg, but let's look at all the a frames in Gatlinburg or the amazing views in Gatlinburg. And what's happening is they're no longer just looking at just Gatlinburg. It's literally all around the Smokies that you see you see the properties. And so only the best of the best homes in that area are actually being shown to people properly. Right? Yeah. If you were in Gatlinburg, you're not competing with every one in the Smokies. Yeah. And so what's happening right now, and this is actually like a pretty crazy thing. What's happening is that all of the boring homes are losing, like, 20 to 30% of the revenue, and all of the absolutely amazing homes are staying steady and consistent, and they're moving forward. Right?

Mike DeHaan: [19:23] Yeah.

John Bianchi: [19:23] Now for me looking at this, I'm like, that is that's absolutely amazing. Every like, that's the smart it's the biggest change that Airbnb made in ten years. I think it's one of the smartest things they've ever did because now all you see are these absolutely amazing listings. Right? But the people who bought there and bought a ton there and just picked up anything because anything was working are the ones that are losing. And so you gotta be in the right spot. You gotta have the right regulation, but you also have the have to have the home that's going to outlast everything. It's got to be the stellar, stellar home. Right? And that's really where I think, you know, Airbnb wins in the long run. And if you're smart enough to do that, and then you kinda you're gonna walk away ahead.

Mike DeHaan: [19:59] Yeah. That that's interesting. That's another risk I actually hadn't even thought about is, you know, you're basing your whole business on a tech company, right? And their algorithms. Just like people that build their entire, you know, marketing and sales funnels through Facebook or Instagram. And then Facebook or Instagram changes their their algorithm, all of sudden your ads don't perform, or you know, you get shadow banned on Instagram, and now your entire business is gone. Exactly. You know, if Airbnb changed their their algorithm, like you said, they have, all of a sudden, if you're not the best, the best you don't have the longest track record. And all of a sudden, you're getting big, which I mean, is A, it's, you know, it's kind like a perfectly competitive market, right? It's economics. Like the better product is going to win. Exactly. But the problem is now, not only are the better products going to be, you know, obviously, like, more interesting than yours, but the algorithm's going to push them. So they're gonna have a competitive advantage that's completely out of your control.

John Bianchi: [20:50] Exactly. Which is wild to think of. It's in in I think one thing you keep touching on that's really important is that people don't understand that it's a business. Right? Like Mhmm. And in every business, you have to be able to adapt and grow and be able to are okay with change. Like, it's not just like I put it up and I walk away and we call it a day. Right? Like, you've got to come out of the gate doing really well and then be okay with whatever is coming and have a sort of backup game plan to it. Right? So like another thing when there's a my a buddy of mine, we're we're both looking to buy properties together. And one of the main things that we're looking for is like, okay. So worst case scenario, can we rent this thing out? Right? And then on top of that, we wanna make sure that we're buying a property that needs some work done to it so we can get some built in equity. Right? And then obviously, like buying it right, not just like throwing whatever we can at it. And we think like, now mind you, I haven't bought a property. Right? And I'm giving I'm saying all these things that I think that if you do this, you can actually win in the Airbnb game, but I don't know for sure. Right? All I know is that I look at the data all day every day, and I see some of these homes that are just absolutely crushing it. Right? And I know that they're they have been crushing it year over year. Right?

John Bianchi: [21:57] So a good example would be Scottsdale. So in Scottsdale, Arizona, you can get a lot of like, there would be a point in time where you get a home there anywhere, and you could be making a good amount of money. Right? But there's one way really to win in Scottsdale, and that's by having an absolutely massive backyard that you've converted into, like, this paradise. Right? Like, a literal, like, putting green. And I would say massive backyard. I mean, like, a a real like, two, three, four times the size of a regular pool backyard. Right?

Mike DeHaan: [22:24] I mean, let let's be honest. You know, party area. People go to Scottsdale to party. Bachelor party. Bachelor party.

John Bianchi: [22:29] Bachelorette parties. Golf party.

Mike DeHaan: [22:30] Like Whatever.

John Bianchi: [22:31] That's exactly it. That's to a team, which and so the thing is is if you have that in Scottsdale, it's not going to lose in the long run because the golf courses are not going anywhere. The weather is gonna keep you in the weather, and people are gonna keep going there. And there's also it's one of the richest areas in all of America. Right? So, like, the the the rich are gonna keep going there as well. And so when you kinda combine all those things together, it works great. Right? It's like a great formula. Now mind you, three years ago, it was 10 times better because of the price of real estate. Now it's, like, really hard to find a place, but you can if you know what you're looking for. But, you know, I don't I can't remember how I got on that tangent, but I just know that there it is possible within specific areas. You just have to be extremely, extremely diligent, which is kind of why what I always talk to people about. Like, you have to understand the data. You have to, like, look at the long run of things. That's why I have that I got two free courses on YouTube that talk about how to understand the Airbnb data to actually, like, make it work. And it's not just a matter of buying as many properties as you can in the Smokies because the Smokies are doing good for one year. Right? Like, the cities are killing it right now. Cities revenue on a property by property basis is up, like, 20 to 50% depending on what what city you look at.

John Bianchi: [23:44] So with that logic, everyone should if they just start running to all these cities and buying all these different properties for Airbnb, they're gonna be really hurt when all this sort of dies down, you know, over the summer or so. Right? And it gets oversaturated. So anyways.

Mike DeHaan: [23:58] That's a good segue to talking about, you know, needing to understand that. So I guess, you know, you have you have your YouTube channel, I've watched some videos, you have some super good stuff on there. And then, you know, you have this data consulting company, I guess, who is like your target demographic for this? Is this people that are already have Airbnbs and they're crushing it, people that are looking to get started? I guess, who's your target avatar? And, you know, what exactly can they expect to get, like, on a more specific level? You know, find, like, cities, whatever. Like, what what's involved in all this?

John Bianchi: [24:26] So the most ideal person that I like to work with is somebody who hasn't started yet, hasn't done anything, and is like just trying to learn. The reason I like working with them the most is because if they talk to me, there's a better chance that they won't get a bad property to start off. Because I'll make sure that they truly understand what they're buying with the numbers. Now, the people who work with me the most are the ones who are active real estate investors. Typically, they have a long term rental portfolio and they're looking to get into the short term rental game. Understand They the importance of looking at the numbers and understanding the numbers before they purchase anything. And hands down, those are, like, the number one people that I work with. Like, they're they're always coming to me. And what I provide to these people is a market analysis. So a report that will show you in any market where the most profitable Airbnb is. Right? On top of that, so that's the tool that you get, and then I also have my process that I teach. And so I teach people exactly how I go through those reports, because I use those reports on a daily basis. So I teach you how to go through those reports and how to identify the most profitable area, unit size, and what qualities in that area that you need to be profitable and beat everybody else, Right? To be that sort of number one property, kinda like I'm talking about the big backyard in Scottsdale.

John Bianchi: [25:40] Like, it's not just a matter of having a big backyard. There's about 20 other requirements. But if you if you can find a property that hits all of those, you're gonna cash flow. Right? And then I, you know, I do a lot of free consulting to help people understand, like, what markets they should be getting into. And that generally leads to one of these reports. And, yeah, it's like the main thing that I provide and help people with.

Mike DeHaan: [25:58] Okay. Cool. So I guess if I wanted to work with you, do I need to come to you and be like, yeah, I'd like to buy a rental home in, like sorry, an Airbnb in, I don't know, X market in Nashville? Or can I say, can I come to you and say, Hey, John, I have $80,000 I want to buy an Airbnb, can you help me find where a good place to get started is? And what should I be looking for?

John Bianchi: [26:20] So the first one, you can come to me for sure, and I can help you out with that. The second one, you'd be better off going to the company that I work for, Superhost Labs, which has this thing called STR in a box, where if you come to us with a budget, we'll help you find a property. We'll find you a property. Yep. So you have both options.

Mike DeHaan: [26:37] I like it. Sweet. I haven't heard of that. Yeah. Awesome. That's super cool. So I guess anything else you wanna add regarding all that? Like, what's the like, is there a process that people should sort of be prepared to? Like, should people reach out to you if they're just curious? Like, do people need to kind of have their ducks in a row?

John Bianchi: [26:53] No. So, I mean, if you have your ducks in a row, it's gonna make it a lot easier for

Mike DeHaan: [26:56] me. Yeah.

John Bianchi: [26:57] Right? Naturally. But, you know, I I usually do like a free fifteen minute Zoom consultation anybody that just has, you know, some questions or if they they're thinking about getting into a market or they wanna see a breakdown of what a market analysis actually looks like. So you can reach out to me at hellopointanalytics dot c o. Once again, that's hellopointanalytics dot c o.

Mike DeHaan: [27:18] Cool. Right on. Perfect. Avi, plug that again at the end really quick. What's that?

John Bianchi: [27:22] A question Yeah. Got a question for you before we end off here.

Mike DeHaan: [27:24] Did I? Yeah. I I was gonna ask you a couple finishing questions, but I got you got your question first.

John Bianchi: [27:29] Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Good. Did I sway your mind at all when it comes to Airbnb? Did I make it did I lean you a little bit more towards maybe Airbnb is viable, or do you are you still as skeptical as you were at the beginning of the call?

Mike DeHaan: [27:42] Oh, I'm I'm still highly skeptical. I'm also very stubborn, so I'll take more than that. But, I mean, I it's not that I don't think it's viable. I just think that I mean, it's just like everything else. Right? I think that it's currently going through a fad phase. I've I've stayed a lot of in a lot of Airbnb's where I have paid an arm and a leg, and I've been into it. I'm like, man, this place freaking sucks. Like, why did I pay so much money for this property? And then now as a investor myself who owns, you know, quite a lot of long term rentals, you know, we have our portfolios about 45 units across, you know, handful of different places, several markets, you know, I've done over 100 transactions in the last couple years. I've gone through the wringer of like doing investments, right, you know, if I own a residential nature. And, like, I just always seem to come back to the fact that if you look at what these people preach with Airbnb and like the extra money you can make, the extra time that it takes to run those Airbnb, you would be better off learning to go on like wholesale properties or flip properties or things like that. Right? You can make you can spend a similar amount of time and make significantly more money if you want to be an investor. And I guess, you know, the kind of chip on my shoulder I always get to use when there's, you know, I'm kind of like a hustler grinder, like we do a lot of dirty work fixing these properties, this whole thing.

Mike DeHaan: [28:55] And then I go to some of these meetups and stuff. And people like, they're like, I'm a bigwig investor. I own four Airbnbs. Like, this is how much money I make. I'm like, that's super cool. But I understand what we do is a little bit different. Yeah. Maybe I may maybe I'm just a little bit crusty like that. I don't know. Yeah.

John Bianchi: [29:10] It sounds like you've you've had your fair share of bad run ins. Yeah. I mean, that's not

Mike DeHaan: [29:15] like that. I mean, it's just it's just like everything else. I I guess my my biggest pet peeve is just like posers. Like, you know, when I go to anything and people like they found like they found the secret sauce. I'm like, I don't know, man. Like, that's cool that you make $1,500 a month cash flow on on your properties. But, you know, with all the time you spent managing those, let's teach you how to go find an off market property that you're buying at 50¢ and a dollar. Right. Like, you're gonna come out so much farther ahead in one year, two years, than if you keep buying, you know, and learning to optimize these these Airbnbs that you're having to, like, put all this extra money and stuff into. So it's just a different model though, right? And some people they want like, I think it's super attractive people because they want the cash flow to be able to leave their w two, is definitely a faster way to get there than my way. Right. But my way, you know, of of doing the wholesales and buying these properties with huge equity discounts, that's gonna get you rich over

John Bianchi: [30:06] a long time, right?

Mike DeHaan: [30:07] Or not even that long, like over a relatively short period of time, honestly.

John Bianchi: [30:10] Yep. And I'll just say right now, you're 100% right. Like that's without a doubt, like, course, you know, you know, you're right. I'm a great you know, I agree with you that you are right. I do think the biggest, like, pull for Airbnb is being able to quit your job.

Mike DeHaan: [30:24] Mhmm.

John Bianchi: [30:24] Anyone who understands anything about real estate knows that it's not, like, the biggest moneymaker, but it provides cash flow. If you do it right, Technically, right? Yeah. Like you gotta you really gotta get the right property.

Mike DeHaan: [30:37] And again, it can be a big moneymaker, though, depending on your your model, right? Like, I mean, I I have wholesale deals, where I've made more than what I made in my first engineering salary out of college.

John Bianchi: [30:47] Yeah, that's unlike one deal.

Mike DeHaan: [30:48] Right? We know it's unreal. But like, when that first time it happened, it seemed unbelievable. But once you build out the system that happens every quarter, right? You know, at least at least once, right? You know, some we've had months that are, you know, obscene, right? So, you know, it's just different. But like, know, when it comes to Airbnb as well, I guess the biggest thing too is the the gurus that push it and the people that eat it up that don't understand the risk at the end of the day. You know, because it's just kind of dishonest and it's it may create a whole situation.

John Bianchi: [31:19] I so I do a lot of presentations for Airbnb coaches. Right? Like, goo Airbnb gurus, people who push it. And I find that the ones who push arbitrage more than anything else tend to have the less smart students. Of

Mike DeHaan: [31:34] course. Yeah. Because you need any money.

John Bianchi: [31:35] I'll say that in a really nice way. Right?

Mike DeHaan: [31:38] You know? Yeah. And it's just like if you go to a, like a wholesaling course, like, you know, if someone goes to a real estate investing course, it's strictly about wholesaling versus like, this is how you build a real estate business, it's going to be very different because the wholesaling can be sold as a quick cash.

John Bianchi: [31:53] It's all quick cash, right? Get money back. Yeah, yeah. It's not really looking at the long term of things, right?

Mike DeHaan: [31:57] Yeah, exactly. So cool. Well, appreciate John. And then I just have a couple closing questions. So, you know, obviously, the space you're in is very competitive, like Airbnb space, you know, the data side you have is super, I guess, like niche, right? But what do you think is like your secret sauce that makes you so good at that? You know, you said it's not necessarily your background. Like, why do you think that that's something that you're able to run with and be so successful?

John Bianchi: [32:23] I just took my I took my time with it. Right? So I took my time with the data. And what I mean by that is like, it takes a lot of time to go through each property to understand exactly why one might be making more than the other and trying to find like a pattern. Right? When I first got started, I literally used to like write all the data out on a piece of paper. And now I have like a program that extracts it all for me in a second. Right? And, like, I still take hours sorting through it. And I still don't believe it sometimes. You know what I mean? And so, like Yeah. It's a process is what I'm trying to get at. And if you follow the process, you build a lot more confidence in what to expect, like what your annual revenue will actually end up being. And, you know, going through the process and then actually opening up the Airbnb and seeing that we made that amount kinda gave me a lot of belief in everything that I'm doing too. So I think that's what makes me a little bit different is like, I'm okay to take my time to try and figure this out, even if it's a grind looking at a lot of numbers.

Mike DeHaan: [33:17] Yeah. You're you're willing to learn. Right? You're willing to put in the which is huge because most people aren't willing to do that.

John Bianchi: [33:22] Yeah. I which is mind boggling, because like, how are you gonna make money if you don't do that? It just doesn't make sense to me.

Mike DeHaan: [33:28] I mean, I don't know. People should try that.

John Bianchi: [33:30] I don't know. Try and then they do it our way. So so

Mike DeHaan: [33:33] Yeah. Exactly. No. They they yeah. They try and then they go back and they say, real estate is a bubble. Yeah. It's not A real thing. I tried to do it two weeks and it's bullshit.

John Bianchi: [33:41] Yeah. Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [33:42] So cool. Your craziest real estate story. I know you said before the show that you have a couple good ones. So if you had one that really sticks in your mind, you walk into a dinner or like a barbecue with a bunch of people you don't know, and they say, you tell them you're a real estate guy. What's the crowd pleaser story that you tell them to make them go like, oh, dang, that's that is a freaking crazy

John Bianchi: [34:00] I don't know if I have a crazy story like that. I'm trying to think of a really good story. Have like cool moments where where like

Mike DeHaan: [34:07] I mean, it doesn't have to be like bad crazy. It can be good crazy.

John Bianchi: [34:10] I got a couple. So like my favorite thing that ever happened in my Airbnb business is that I found a property toured it, got the landlord to say yes to Airbnb, signed the lease and and gave them the deposit all within, I think it was like thirty minutes or forty five minutes. And that property was the most profitable property that I had. It made me like $40,000 of cash flow. Right? It was like, nice, you know, it just happened so quick. It all went so smooth. It all went so well. I was like, this is amazing. Right? It's like, was a home run for me. Another time, though, I had to kick out a gang of drug dealers out of from the South Side Of Chicago, out of one of my properties, and they wouldn't leave. But they literally legitimately would not leave. They wouldn't leave till the next morning. But I actually had, like, a great conversation with one of the guys there. He ended up being, like, super, super nice. And it just seemed like he was just born in the wrong spot, but that's always a good one too. I don't know. Those are those are like the two ones that come to my mind, like instantly, but they're not great stories. They're more of just like good little things that kinda happen.

Mike DeHaan: [35:06] You just gotta work on the delivery of it, man. You gotta play up like the the gang banger aspect, you know, like, did you actually, you go knock on the door

John Bianchi: [35:15] or did you have someone do

Mike DeHaan: [35:16] it for you?

John Bianchi: [35:16] Yeah. Like, I'll give you more details on that story. Because like, yeah, these guys are, they brought their own speaker, massive, massive speaker. Right? Mind you, one point out this barely ever happens. And I feel there's a ways to like avoid it. Massive speaker that they bring though. Right? And it's blaring through the house. I live down the street. So I came I got like complaints from the neighbors. I come over, tell them to turn it down. They didn't turn it down. And I left and they you know, I was playing again. I came back, turned to tell it down. And then I'm like, I'm not fucking leaving until you fucking turn this thing down. And like, all these guys are in there. And you know, I'm I'm like, I'm like, this is just not safe. Like, I should not be I can't yell at these guys, but I wouldn't leave. I was like, I'm I'm sitting outside this door until you guys leave. And then I had one guy come out and he just started he was like, I'm not kidding you. 22 years old. We talked for a half an hour. He had to be like the nicest guy I've ever met. He was just talking about like what he's like he's like, you know, we rent out these Airbnbs because there's grown men trying to kill us over on the South Side.

John Bianchi: [36:11] So we hide out over here. And this is where this is what we've gotta do and and all this stuff. And I'm just like, that's not my world at all. Like, whatsoever. And then another guy, one of the neighbors heard from the balcony about the guy, like, gang banging in jail and, like, how he had do shit in jail. And he was like, he was just telling me stories. And that guy actually, like, walked by me in the hall and it was like a tight hall and he wouldn't turn his back to me the whole way as he, like, as like crept around the I was like, alright, I need to leave. Yeah, I didn't have any backup or anything. And like, I didn't wanna call the cops because it was an Airbnb and I was just like, I was like, I'm just gonna wait. I'm like, I'm not gonna call it. I threatened to call the cops on them, but like, they're like, some of us have felonies or warrants out for arrest and stuff like that. Like, please don't call. Please don't call. All that shit. I'm like, well, just get the fuck out of my house. Like, leave. Yeah. But anyways

Mike DeHaan: [37:00] So funny. Yeah. Nah. It's it's a little bit of culture for you. I mean, you said you're from Canada. Don't have a lot

John Bianchi: [37:05] of that. No. No. Definitely not. Especially in the town I live in. Like there's none of that.

Mike DeHaan: [37:10] That's funny. No, that's awesome. All right. And then one last question, the number one tip you have for people that want to grow their business.

John Bianchi: [37:19] Learn, like study everything you can about cash flow. And what I mean by that, maybe more so like managing your cash, right, extremely well. I think one of the biggest, like, not one of the guaranteed, the biggest mistake that I made was just not fully understanding how to properly manage the money that was coming in and how to properly invest it, where it was gonna be going. I've read a bunch of books since then. Watched and learned as much as I possibly could, and I'm still learning constantly about what, you know, how to properly manage money. But I think, you know, cash is king. So you have to make sure that your business always has money coming in, and then reusing that money strategically to be able to continue to grow while still having that buffer room is what's gonna allow you to really become a strong business over a long period of time. And that's something that, you know, I kinda learned along the way, but wasn't able to fully implement because COVID shut down my business. But I would say if there's anything that I could go back to again and learn even harder, it would be managing your cash flow and managing your money, so that you can grow properly.

Mike DeHaan: [38:18] You have any good resource or anything you like for that?

John Bianchi: [38:20] Yeah. Profit First is a book that I read. Good money. You know, some, like, high level stuff like Tony Robbins and Dave Davis or something, what's his name, have, like, some good, like, personal money management stuff.

Mike DeHaan: [38:31] Was about to say, don't you say Dave Ramsey right now in a real

John Bianchi: [38:34] estate Listen. No. No. No. Not in real estate. But, like, I I don't I'm not promoting Dave Ramsey. I'm just saying there's little tidbits from every one of these people that you can take that might be a little bit good to have in as a mindset for when you're kinda moving forward on things. Right? For sure. And so I know, I know, I know exactly how everyone feels, but the reality is it's more of just like a mindset. Right? There's like another one about, the psychology of money. I'm looking at my bookshelf right now. And there's another one that I read recently. Oh, I will teach you to be rich. All these books are not like, you know, accounting books for your business and like how to properly manage it, but they're books that help you manage your own personal money, which very easily translates to your business money. And if you can keep a good handle on both of those, it'll help move things forward. For me, that was the biggest driver without a doubt. Read five books in a very short period of time. And like the implemented, like everything they were saying, and it helped me like crazy. So

Mike DeHaan: [39:26] yeah, I mean, sometimes that's all it takes, man. Like, you know, I for me, the biggest thing I read, when I back when I was still a corporate engineer, I read the four hour workweek. And that was like my my red pill, you know, from the matrix, like all of sudden, like woke up and I was like, Oh my God,

John Bianchi: [39:40] what Mine are you was Rich Dad Poor Dad. There you

Mike DeHaan: [39:44] go. Yeah, that's a common one.

John Bianchi: [39:46] Yeah, big time. It's such an easy read, right?

Mike DeHaan: [39:48] Yep, exactly. Well, John. We got a lot of cool stuff going on. I know you said your email before, but where else can people find with you? What name are your YouTube channel? How can people reach out? How do you like to connect with people?

John Bianchi: [39:58] The best way to find me is just on YouTube. That's really the only place I am. So you can find me on YouTube. My name is my exact name. So it's John Bianchi, j o h n b I a n c h I. You type that into YouTube, it's gonna pop up. I recommend anybody who's, like, even thinking about reaching out to me to just watch some of the videos and watch some of the stuff I teach about so that you have an understanding of, like, what I can do. And you might not even need to reach out to me because it's out there for free. Yeah. I mean, that's the best place to go. And then if you wanna try and, you know, reach out, you can go to the about page on YouTube, and it's gonna have some additional links, including my email that you can find me, and we can hop on a call.

Mike DeHaan: [40:34] Perfect. Yeah. Cool. Well, thanks so much for, coming on here, John. Was great to have you. And if you guys enjoyed this show sorry, this episode of the collecting keys podcast, go ahead and subscribe and leave us a five star review. That would be great. And we will be having more guests like John here in the future. And then if you are interested in learning how we find off market deals and learning from Dan and myself, go and check out the instantinvestorprogram.com. And go ahead and book a call with me, and we will see if you'd be a good fit to come into our group mastermind program. So besides that, guys, thanks so much, and talk to you next week.

Speaker 2: [41:08] Thanks for listening. Please leave us a review on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. And check us out at collectingkeyspodcast.com for tips and guides on starting your own real estate investment and wholesaling business.