Can You Leverage A Broker’s License As A Wholesaler?

Dan Austin: [0:00] I guess my only opinion on this is if you're going to go out and get a license and think that that's going to build a large robust revenue stream for you, I think you're better off just getting better at wholesaling.

Mike DeHaan: [0:16] What's going on guys? Welcome to today's episode of the Collecting Keys Real Estate Investing Podcast. Today is Wednesday. This is the Mike and Dan show. This is your first time here. We are the show that teaches you how to make massive income, not just passive income with your real estate investing business. And on these Wednesday shows, you are joined by me, Mike DeHaan, my co host here, Dan Austin. Hello. And we talk about real estate investing, business and whatever else we feel like for the week. But anyways, as we are rounding out January, we have a lot going on in our business and also in the real estate market as a whole. So I guess, it's funny, we were kinda going through everything over the next couple of weeks and we have like almost, I feel like a quarter's worth or half a year's worth of stuff lined up Yeah. Here in like the next like two weeks because we have what like 10 closings between now and February 1 which is next Friday, so I guess four days after you guys listen to this, you guys listen to this. Yeah, 10 closings there, we just went under contract on our first commercial property that we're planning to buy. We started due diligence on that. Little office space.

Mike DeHaan: [1:31] We're looking at a couple duplexes right now in seller finance that we might pick up. We have two different flips closing, which are the result of our subject to notes that got called. If you guys have been listening over the past couple of months, you've probably heard that story, so I won't beat it to death anymore. But those should be closing over the next couple weeks. What else do we have? We got a unit we We have going got bedbugs. We got bedbugs again

Dan Austin: [1:57] twice, so the same unit. We we are hopefully selling this. The deal's closed. We have a deal we're selling right now, our solar wrap that we're selling from our personal portfolio.

Mike DeHaan: [2:07] Finally closing. What are we? On a ten week closing timeline?

Dan Austin: [2:11] I'm walking on a fine line, I'm ready for this thing to blow up at any minute, like it's getting to the point to where I just found out that our previous closing agent never actually paid the taxes, the prorated taxes on behalf of the seller at closing, and so we do have a due tax bill Really? That we are not responsible for, the previous owners are, which they're gonna be pissed, which is gonna probably bring light to the whole situation and they're be like, what's going on here? And you know, they're not gonna be happy.

Mike DeHaan: [2:36] Is that an error by our title Yes, escrow company yeah. On the

Dan Austin: [2:39] Yeah. And, of course, our escrow company, the one that services the note, is like been calling and sending letters to everybody. I'm like, I have not received a single thing or correspondence, but I know our closing attorney probably has, or our closing agent probably has because they're a business and they actually have phone numbers at work and emails apparently, so which I don't know where they are sending our stuff but it's

Mike DeHaan: [3:00] not coming to me. Nice. That's fun.

Dan Austin: [3:02] Yeah. We're walking a fine tight rope on that one, but yeah, just among other things, like, we got a lot going

Mike DeHaan: [3:07] So Ike's all in all just between our closings, yeah, the wholesale deals and the stuff that we're selling and potential potentially buying, we have like 16 or 17 base codes and next three weeks. We

Dan Austin: [3:25] got our freaking rock star, our rock star transaction coordinator that's based in The Philippines is freaking handle it all like a channel.

Mike DeHaan: [3:33] She's been doing pretty well. Like honestly, it's funny like, I feel like so many people have bad experiences with VAs, A, because they probably recruit them and manage them poorly, but B, they don't encourage them or allow them to I think that's one of the big things, which you do need to find good ones that actually wanna learn, which we're fortunate to have done that. But I mean she's, I don't know, generally more reliable than a lot of The US based employees we have. She shows up every day.

Dan Austin: [3:58] More reliable than I am.

Mike DeHaan: [3:59] She never complains about anything. No.

Dan Austin: [4:02] No, she's doing good. That's a lot of work to handle too. Balance, a lot of different stuff going on.

Mike DeHaan: [4:06] Yeah, yeah, so that's been good to see. And then with the scale community, found a lot going on there. We started up some sales training, which has been good. We have our second iterations of that tomorrow, which And I'm excited with our, we started doing sales training with our scale community, which was something that we did at KeyesCon, which is our in person event a couple months ago. We kind of had like an impromptu sales accountability and training like on-site there which people were kind of thrown by but then they, a lot of them said it was their favorite part of the entire event. So we decided to bring it and figure out a way to do it virtually on Zoom for people in our scale community. And so what that is, it's like a ninety minute call we do every two weeks. And we do like a sales review, like a call review and a training the first half hour. And then for the next sixty minutes we like split people into groups and we actually have them do like round robin accountability, doing their lead follow-up, and actually helping coach and navigate problems like who as to they're talking to these different sellers. And the first one we actually had a guy get a deal accepted and under contract like during that which is pretty rad.

Dan Austin: [5:11] Yeah, was was sick. I was sitting there watching it and I was like, this is awesome. He did a fantastic job too and that was a lot of fun to do and the community and the camaraderie builds

Mike DeHaan: [5:22] It does.

Dan Austin: [5:22] Really is good, because we're doing it where you're in a small group, like three or four people, and we're like, hey, if you don't have leads, you're not off the hook. Like you're calling somebody You else's better do a good job because it's like they're leads, right? But like, we always say it's better that somebody else calls it if nobody calls And them, yeah, it's just like a really great opportunity to learn and and like sharpen your, you know, steel sharpens steel, right? So sharpening your toolset and like getting to give other people feedback and sometimes listening to other people do it, you pick little nuances up, but also giving feedback like you learn through teaching and all that stuff, and so it's just good all around, it's a lot of fun.

Mike DeHaan: [5:55] Yeah, and it was fun to do something that's actionable as well, because I feel like so many different communities, the people are involved in, or even like generally when we coach or we have people that get on calls and things like that, they wanna talk about a lot of theoretical stuff, which is great, that's important. But to have the opportunity to get people to do things that's actionable, and is actually getting them to like do the stuff that they've been procrastinating on and that everyone procrastinates on forever.

Dan Austin: [6:19] Well yeah, and you know what the other thing is, is like we've paid for like our team to go through sales training and stuff and a lot of that is back to theory or they're doing like hypothetical situations, which is fine, right? That's better than nothing. But like, there's no better way in our opinions for what we seem to do it than a real life person who isn't going to steer the conversation to prove whatever like value point that they want to drive, that drives their personal ego as the instructor of Yeah. Sales You know, because like, if you're sitting there and I always love seeing these videos where it's like this hard charging, like type A, like sales guy, he's teaching his sales team all this stuff, and he's throwing out things like, well, and they pretending to be the seller in some scenario, and of course they steer the conversation to make their video look like they're a badass. Right? Yeah. And that their sales that their training sucks, and they're actually gonna teach them how to do it, then you sign up for their sales training course. Yeah. That's not always realistic. Sometimes it's just like an old dude that's like, I don't

Mike DeHaan: [7:13] know, what do you wanna offer me? That is always kind of the question I've had around the sales training and different things that I know people get or people coach that way. I mean I'm not a sales coach, I don't have like a track record of building these like 8 or 9 figure sales teams like a lot of these guys claim to do. But it just like fundamentally doesn't make sense. Some of like the different, they're like, yeah, we're gonna do like a sales scrimmage, we're gonna do these things, because you're practicing with like a loaded person, right, that like already knows all the different ways that conversation can go, and like is gonna tee things up,

Dan Austin: [7:47] well they put in a box that doesn't have a way for you to like actually be creative or creative because like that's what I mean, is like the scrimmage is set up for the person on the other side to like control it in a way that's maybe not

Mike DeHaan: [7:58] For real, sure, it's like if you're trying to train someone to be in the NFL, you're not gonna take them to play like middle school ultimate frisbee. You know, like it's just not a, like I guess the concept's the same, you gotta be able to like throw an item and like catch and like run, but you're not gonna be able to like take hits. You're throwing something that's completely different, know, you're not gonna be able to like maneuver quite the same. Like it just doesn't make sense, right? You're just not, it's not apple to apple but I mean I guess it's better than doing nothing.

Dan Austin: [8:27] That's what I was gonna say, think that that stuff is valuable in lieu of like doing nothing, but like just talk to real leads if you have the opportunity to, that's what you know practicing and getting out there in the real world is what's gonna make you better.

Mike DeHaan: [8:39] For sure. And if you don't have that, just find ways to get it. Know, run marketing. Like if you need to practice calling leads and you never run marketing, you don't have any leads, get on a freaking cold call, like a dialer, and start hitting that. It'll be miserable. But you know what, you'll get your reps in.

Dan Austin: [8:53] Yeah. And nobody loves that.

Mike DeHaan: [8:56] If you're like, I don't wanna do that, then hire a company to do it. You know, hire a cold calling or a marketing team and then talk to leads after they come in.

Dan Austin: [9:04] I mean, here's the reality of the situation too. Like, if you're trying to figure out how to start this and you're like, oh, suck at sales or or I don't know anything about this, go into it like you're saying, go figure out how to get set up on a dialer, get some data to call these people, and just start cold calling people, and if you do that long enough, like, will find a deal, like, guarantee. Like, you'll get good enough, and you'll understand it, and you'll figure out real estate, you'll you'll get a deal, and from that point on, you'll know how to make money.

Mike DeHaan: [9:28] Mhmm. Totally.

Dan Austin: [9:29] No matter what's going on. If you know, if you can pick up the phone and start cold calling people to generate revenue, which you can, like anybody can do, right? Some people are better than others, Like that's an amazing skill set that you should feel really good Yeah,

Mike DeHaan: [9:41] and I think the biggest mistake people make is they start that, and they pivot, or the one that gets me right now, but as of right now it's been like this for a while, you'll have the people that start marketing to be like a wholesaler, an off market investor, and every single lead that comes back, because this always happens, just so you know, regardless, they want too much for their property, they want retail price. Of course they do. Every single person wants the full value of their asset. They're not gonna to you at a discount because they feel like it, they have to have a reason to you, they have some kind of motivation, how it seems to be worth, you wanna do this really quick. That's where we as wholesalers especially make money. But what most people do is they get like their first 30 or 40 leads that come in that are like that, and instead of diving in trying to see if there actually is a motivation or situation where they can make money with it on a discounted price, they go, I'm gonna go and become a realtor too, so that I can go and get all these listings. And you know, I think the success rate of people that decide to add that as a like additional vertical, additional opportunity must be pretty dang close to zero. Because I feel like we have a lot of people.

Dan Austin: [10:47] Well, especially if you do it after a fail at opportunity and like you're trying to do it to increase income, there are people out there that have done one or the other and they do one very successfully and they decide to add a profit center to the other one because of opportunity in their market. And they usually have somebody else manage or run the other piece for them, if not a business partner.

Mike DeHaan: [11:05] And that's the thing, right? Is they basically try to either run them in tangent, and what they're doing is they're saying, I'm running marketing to either wholesale or to list these properties I'm gonna try and explore both of them at the same time. The problem is if you have this listing opportunity in your back pocket, you're never even gonna do the hard work to dive in to explore the wholesale opportunity because you're always gonna be like, oh they want too much money, I'm just gonna offer to list it. And they're like, I don't actually wanna sell, screw you. Or it doesn't make sense for me to put it And on the it just goes to nothing versus if you're like, I need to figure out how to wholesale this deal. You're gonna do the discovery calls, You're gonna meet them at the house. You're gonna hear about the divorce they didn't tell you about on the first seven calls that you had, right? You're gonna just like hear about the tenant that was raising hamsters in the freaking basement, and now there's an infestation that's inside the walls. Right? Those are the things that if you are instantly just focused on the money, right, or the money that they want and not wanting to have a hard conversation, you're gonna miss that completely and you're gonna do nothing.

Dan Austin: [12:08] Absolutely and here's the real reality of it too. Say you start out a wholesaler and you're running the marketing as you should, the generally speaking, the cost to run that marketing is not applicable to the revenue stream that you will get as a realtor. For example, you might be able to get a $20,000 wholesale deal but the net commission after you pay for all your professional photos and stuff on that might be say $6.

Mike DeHaan: [12:34] If you're lucky that have to split it with your broker, right? So it's probably really $3.

Dan Austin: [12:39] Right. So so really $3, right? And so, what if your cost per deal ends up becoming $4,000, which it usually does on the wholesale side, somewhere in there, 3 to 5,000 I

Mike DeHaan: [12:49] would say

Dan Austin: [12:49] is like a very good broad range cost per deal. From a marketing standpoint, well you're gonna be running out at a net loss, you're gonna beat your head off the wall, like why am I not making more money and you're gonna be working your tail off. And what we've found over time, even just running with normal acquisition managers, when we give them the opportunity to like, hey pivot to a retail listing, will always Right, do because if any money is better than no money and they immediately would jump to that, so we have to be really diligent and coach them, it's like, no we don't, we're not doing retail listings or retail referrals. That's like something that shakes out of the bottom, and it's like, oh, yeah, that that'll work, cool. But that is never the primary, and like, when they tell you, hey, when they say no to your $150,000 offer, I want 300,000, that doesn't mean you list it and try to, or try to do a referral fee to an agent. That means you need to dig in and work with them, because reality is, most of the time from what we've seen, trying to monetize your wholesale marketing leads as retail listings is, they're just not retail people.

Mike DeHaan: [13:48] Mhmm. They have, a

Dan Austin: [13:48] lot of times they're calling you, especially if you're doing direct mail, they're calling you because they didn't wanna go with an agent. If they're gonna go with an agent, they'll go with a guy down the road from them that's been beating on their door for the last six months.

Mike DeHaan: [13:59] Mhmm. Yeah. Or what they're gonna do is they're gonna go through this whole process, exactly trying to sell on being an agent, and they're gonna end up working with like their hairdresser's neighbor's nephew, just because that's a more trustworthy person to them than you are.

Dan Austin: [14:12] Right, well and oftentimes they're gonna want a discount, right? Like what is your sales pitch at that point? Oh yeah. You know, and they're gonna wanna discount because they don't see you necessarily as a premium realtor. Like, there's realtors in town, like, that we know and see. Like, they don't even negotiate on commission. They're like, no, if you're not gonna do the full price, if you don't agree with my service at a full price, you're not the right fit for me. Go to a discount

Mike DeHaan: [14:32] Exactly, man. And those are the

Dan Austin: [14:34] folks that are really crushing on that. They'll do that. Like they're good at retail listings and drumming up that kind of business.

Mike DeHaan: [14:40] Yeah, and the funny thing is, is there are those people and they decide that they're gonna go and be a wholesaler. And you know what happens? They usually fail because it's a different sales process, a different conversation. Know, they can build teams that can go and help make that a little bit more successful. But I don't think I personally know anyone that has had a super successful wholesaling team and then stood up a good brokerage alongside, or vice versa, has had a really good brokerage and then stood up a successful wholesaling team. I've seen some that are kinda like, one is really good and the other one kind of exists, right? To have them both just being you crushed just don't that very often. And if anybody knows that person, please send me a DM on Instagram at Mike underscore Invest, because I would love to have them on the show, because we've literally never heard of that.

Dan Austin: [15:23] Yeah, that's pretty well on the show. Yeah, would love to see how they're doing it. That's a, that begs another question. So we had a great, there's a lot of guys jumping on a similar topic adjacent to this about getting your broker license as a wholesaler, not just necessarily stand up a firm, but to help with being an off market real estate investor. Like what are your thoughts on that? We had a pretty, there was a pretty robust like engagement from our community on this.

Mike DeHaan: [15:45] That's always a tough question, right? And it's one that comes up a lot. And I think a lot of people when they're like brand new, they think that, and this was me as well, they think that going through that process of getting their license will make them more educated on Which real if you actually study the stuffs in the real estate exams, there is some valuable information in there for sure. Most people don't. Like if you just go talk to the average realtor about what they know about their real estate process, you'll understand very quickly that it's not that valuable. Certain states, I mean it's different than others like Texas or, I know Texas is a good one because says non disclosure state and it's also very common for wholesalers to use the MLS specific forms down there. Other non disclosure it can be very valuable for you to have access to the MLS.

Dan Austin: [16:34] Yeah, because in a non disclosure state you're not gonna be able to get the comping, right?

Mike DeHaan: [16:38] Yeah, exactly.

Dan Austin: [16:39] You know, but you can get that by partnering with a great realtor that will do that for you as long as you're giving them enough business on the back end of things.

Mike DeHaan: [16:46] Yeah, I mean the biggest risk with it, I mean some states already have this as challenge. So in Washington State, technically you're a fiduciary to sellers here if you have a retail license. Which means that you have to basically make the seller aware that you're an agent and that you are buying their property for less than it's worth. If you don't you can get slapped with some very very heavy fees. And that doesn't, I guess technically exist everywhere, which seems weird to me. But I imagine it's gonna start coming around nationwide pretty quickly, especially with all this with polluting the National Association of Realtors over the past couple months. Like they're gonna start slamming down on that pretty hard.

Dan Austin: [17:25] Yeah, looking to make sure that their job, a lot of these attorney generals, they wanna help the consumer, which is the seller the buyer So in these they're gonna probably start seeing, we'll probably see some legislation state by state. I think, so there's some value in a broker's license, you have to know whether it's adding enough value for to maintain it. So in Washington State, so when we started out, at some point I got my broker's license after our first year of operation and we were, the goal there was that we were going to use that for referral deals, we'd be able to refer out to brokers, list their own properties, as well as pick up listings.

Mike DeHaan: [18:01] Of

Dan Austin: [18:01] Like which we've we've done it all. But, I would argue, for us in Washington, with the way it works, is it really not that big of a benefit to have. Because we we're not a non disclosure state, we have Zillow is bad ass if you're trying to comp properties. Like, you can do it so much faster than if you go on our MLS and try to pull like a full on CMA. Because like the CMA takes just as much data input to feed that system the way ours is set up and time as it it's like double or triple for me to go just look at Zillow and find three properties. I'm like, yep, this is boom, I'm done. So speed right there, we don't need it. When we're doing like our full operation of flipping houses like, yeah, you're gonna save a few bucks on the listing when you're flipping, but just find an expert badass if that's what they do, go find, what I would argue is go find the best realtor that in can sell properties like the best of them, right? And pay them a full commission, because you're always gonna get a better, you're always gonna get a better price, like it's true. Especially in these markets now where it's not like, where you just throw it up and you sell it under rehab, all that crap, like iPhone photos, now you need to be like really good at that.

Dan Austin: [19:07] And if you find an agent, which we work with, we've worked with one here in the past recently, that knows how to negotiate on your behalf, those people also carry weight within the realtor circle, and so other realtors respect them, and they'll kind of like, back down a little bit when they're trying to negotiate on your behalf, and help, and to kind of help you, you know, out on that, on that. So, I think that's just even from listing your own properties. Like, you think you're saving a few bucks and maybe it does help, but it's really not that valuable.

Mike DeHaan: [19:33] Well, think bottom line, you can potentially be saving money because you're not paying as much of a commission or SPC, but you're clearly right, they don't see the potential, the higher upside on the deal. And the big thing that always seems to get overlooked, and I think it's because new people don't have a ton of opportunity yet, is the opportunity cost of that. Right? And that's what we learned is, remember when you first got your license, you're like, oh yeah, you'll just list our properties and do all these things. You're wasting all this freaking time. When it's like really what you should have been doing is managing more flits, and helping secure more rental properties since our setup was you kinda did the post contract stuff, I did the pre contract stuff. And lo and behold, you were now getting stretched too thin doing dumb stuff, like going to like do a walk through with not that serious of buyers do things. It's like just pay the person If 33% honestly breaks your deal, it's a shitty deal and you shouldn't have bought it in the first place.

Dan Austin: [20:23] Totally. Right. And the person that you're doing that to, you're finding is, assuming they're a great broker, have coordinator that you're getting that goes along with it. They have escrow contacts that they're, you're gonna go along with. They have all these other contacts that they build because that's their business. And if, like I said, if they're if they're top level, top shelf realtor, so to speak, like, they're going to have a really a a plus team. We didn't have that.

Mike DeHaan: [20:43] Yeah.

Dan Austin: [20:44] Right? So we're saving 3% of commission, but we don't have a transaction coordinator, because a lot of times as a smaller wholesale operation, you're not gonna have a TC on staff We like didn't have all the systems in place and processes to where their job is solely to market that property for us and have all the systems to do it work. Yeah. You know, we didn't. So then, yeah, then you get in the game of like, wasting your time doing that and then then you're trying to chase down also when you're chasing down listings and stuff like that, you're trying to chase down referral fees that you're doing, like, it just kinda adds up to where I think there is value, but you really have to understand how much time you're gonna end spending to monetize that. And then in Washington, you gotta do the the whatever ninety credit hours of education plus the test, and then the first after the first renewal, like your first two years, because the licenses last two years here in Washington, you have to do another sixty hours of CEs, then you have to do so many every single year just to maintain it, plus quarterly fees, annual dues, all that stuff adds up. Like, they changed lock boxes recently here in our MLS and I could not get the new ones so because of some stupid email thing and realtors are just like other real estate investors, like the MLS, are not tech savvy. So now I have lock boxes I still haven't swapped out, so I can't even put things on houses and get access to them and other people ask. Like, it's just like this silly thing.

Mike DeHaan: [22:00] You know what's something so funny is like, why is the MLS so freaking complicated to use when realtors like can't use the most basic technology most

Dan Austin: [22:08] Wow.

Mike DeHaan: [22:08] It doesn't make any sense.

Dan Austin: [22:09] Well, especially, there's probably some that like their MLS

Mike DeHaan: [22:12] I

Dan Austin: [22:12] don't badass because MLS just so you know, if you're not familiar with it, they're very local. So ours, we we work in Spokane, Washington, so like our MLS is specific to the Spokane County and the greater area around here. That's within, I don't know, like an hour drive probably around in north, south, east, west from here, because there's some rural areas too that it encompasses. And then the tech stack around that is very rudimentary, Like it's not super easy to use. And so like, you just like, especially when I first signed up as a realtor, some of the stuff was really really bad and it's gotten a little bit better now, but like, it's not the best. So for us, it's like, how valuable is it? For sure. Yeah. To deal with the headaches of doing forms and all the other crap you have to do. Because when you do like an off market transaction, we typically have our right, data we're buying as is, we're doing all this stuff. You go to our MLS, you've got like six or seven mandatory forms you have to fill out and all these other things that add together. It's like a 30 page PSA by the time you don't.

Mike DeHaan: [23:04] Yeah. And I really do think that a lot of people pursue that and should do that themselves because they feel like they're saving money, but in reality it's because they are afraid of doing the work that's harder that's gonna make more money which is you know, calling more leads, doing more marketing, making more offers. Yeah. Mean, yeah, they said, you have to kinda learn it yourself. You remember like that freaking portfolio that was owned by that family that the mom died, or dad died, whoever it was. That we enlisted like all their properties. There was like five And of we did this purely because we were competing with other wholesalers to try and buy the houses, and they just had more financial power than we did. So we were never gonna able to compete with their offers, and we just, instead we and just burned the we're like, oh well, all these people are undercutting you, this is what your properties are actually worth and we'll list them for that, and so they would go with us. So it was almost like a Yep.

Dan Austin: [23:56] And we're like, if you can't sell it, if we can't sell at this price, we'll buy them.

Mike DeHaan: [23:59] Mhmm. Right. Yeah, we probably heard that on a podcast or something. And that was our arrangement was we said, we get some at this price, we'll buy them at this price, which was like just below the list price minus, you know, retail fees and everything else. This is 2021, so you could sell anything on the market, which

Dan Austin: [24:15] Yeah, and we did

Mike DeHaan: [24:16] We did sell sell these properties. But I just remember like the dumb stuff, like you had to keep going to that one, because the tenant would throw a tantrum every time.

Dan Austin: [24:24] Dude, there's this one property that I listed and there's this old dude that had an oxygen tank and he was sitting and he smoked in Yeah. The was gross, right? It was a gross house and just not a nice person in general. And then this, their neighbor came out one time, he's an old guy, the neighbor was probably 80, and he tried fighting me. As the broker, I'd like my signs in the yard, I'd get all these calls from all these people about how much of like a terrible person I am for selling the prop, I'm like, I'm just the, I am literally just the listing broker. I'm sorry that these guys have to move out when they're selling it, we had to issue them a notice and I helped the owners through that, but literally this 80 year old dude, literally almost, like he came at me and got like an inch from my face and wanted to fight me because I was a terrible person, I was like, this is not worth it.

Mike DeHaan: [25:07] It's so funny, I mean like those are the same people, right, that are like, shame on realtors for marking up the prices of property so much, like it's disgusting. Like there should be anti capitalism rules against realtors. That's not how it works at all.

Dan Austin: [25:22] Yeah. That it's not how it works. Like, hey, Yeah. Come on That was a tough one. Mean, I don't even know we netted on that, out of, like we sold like four houses for them and I bet you our net commission to the business after like paid the broker and all that was less than a wholesale fee. You know what I mean? On our, it was less than our average wholesale fee.

Mike DeHaan: [25:38] If I remember, think it was like 18,500. Because they were all like 200 to 300 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What a waste of time. Like honestly.

Dan Austin: [25:49] Was it worth it? Yes, to make sure our competition didn't buy it, but you know.

Mike DeHaan: [25:52] Well see, but that was what we were doing, because at that point in time, there was basically us and like two others in town, and we're like, they just have like a huge fund, and we're like, we can't compete with them on this. So we just said, we'll just burn the bridge. And so like we only, we made 18 positive but they didn't make a 100 k and that was all we cared about.

Dan Austin: [26:10] Yeah. Exactly. Boom, that's all that mattered. So you gotta do what you gotta do, you know?

Mike DeHaan: [26:15] So yeah, it's just such an interesting reoccurring question. We get that, I don't know, I feel like it comes up once a week in scale at least where people are asking about it. And I guess to bring it full circle, the answer is it depends on your market, right? Look at what the ups the upsides are of it and the downsides. Look at the reoccurring costs. Look at the reoccurring education. Make sure that you're not gonna be doing something where you're going to be getting yourself into a situation where you're at risk of litigation, because you're now, you're still gonna be trying to make discounted offers on properties. Check all that. And then make a decision yourself. There is no right or wrong answer. Depends on the market, depends on you. But the real answer is don't do it because you shouldn't. But that's awesome. But in reality, there is no right or wrong.

Dan Austin: [26:59] Yeah. If you already have a license, it's not gonna be a big deal to keep it, like, stuff like that. But if you're if my I guess my only opinion on this is if you're going to go out license and think that that's going to build a large robust revenue stream for you, I think you're better off just getting better at this. Yeah, I'm not gonna beat you up for going getting a realtor license and monetizing it somewhat, because there's some value too, like, right? Like, if you wanted to sell your house, Mike, have my bursaries, I'm just gonna list it for you, you don't have to go tune up, you know what I mean? Stuff like that, where there's some value, if you care about that. I can go walk any house I want here in Spokane, if I wanna go buy a new house, that's fine. Don't have to bug anybody, but it's not Yeah.

Mike DeHaan: [27:36] Or even like little stuff, like when I bought this house here, you know, you were my buyer's agent, you know, you were able to make some money I was able to save a bunch on fees, it worked out great. Yeah. Exactly.

Dan Austin: [27:45] Yeah. Yeah. There you go. There's a positive, it's like not not negative, but yeah, the moral of the story is I don't think that you should think of that as a major profit center that you should grow when you're trying to, in reality, grow a wholesale business, because the transactions you'll do there will be much more valuable, and the skill set that you build there is going to be very specific and valuable to real estate investors.

Mike DeHaan: [28:03] Yep, exactly. So, yeah, and it's just like everything else, you know, just because it's in the real estate realm doesn't mean it's all in like the same path. Just like, you know, somebody who's really good at cooking pizza isn't gonna be the same as cooking sushi, right, just because it's food really doesn't mean it's the same freaking thing. It's different skill sets, different systems, different processes. Even though your pipeline of leads is the same, like, it's a whole different sales process and product that you're delivering at the end. So it's important not to co mingle them. Yep. Alright. I was telling that's a pretty good place to wrap up. Thanks for listening everybody. We appreciate you hopping on. You should go to collectingkeys.com/sub2 and you can get our free course that will teach you all you need to know about subject to transactions. And hopefully that will allow you to avoid or at least mitigate any damage when you get a subject to loan called like we did last month, which was a really really fun six weeks figuring that out. So Mhmm. Go to collectthekeys.com/subto, grab that free course and you'll get a good education. And it's all the stuff that like Pace Morby teaches you but it only cost you 10 k, it's completely free.

Dan Austin: [29:04] Yeah. Except for we try to fill in the gaps of things that the gurus like Pace aren't teaching. Yeah. Right? Which is like the risks associated with any creative financing transaction you just gotta be

Mike DeHaan: [29:12] aware of. Just like yeah. Any kind of real estate there's risk of it and that one just because few people understand there's always extra. But go check that out and appreciate you all. Talk to you guys next week.

Dan Austin: [29:23] See you.